Hello guys

This is my first post here. I am currently a student studying commerce and need a new hobbie. I love music with a passion and think I'd be into house/trance.

Today I talked to these guys at the local DJ shop (DMC I think) and they gave me some advice. The cheapest decent decks with a direct drive (I just learnt what a direct drive is...well I know it's better than the belt drive or so they say!) cost around $1800 (NZ dollars).

DJ'ing is an expensive hobbie and I want to have a dabble in it to see if I like it. There are some 4 week DJ courses that I may have a go at, but if any of you could tell me what makes a successfull DJ? I'm not the most outgoing of people but I love my music.

thanks for your time

- John

Hi,

Welcome to the Forum, hope you'll visit us often and enjoy your time here

I'm a UK based equipment distributor, and i've just done a currency conversion from NZD to our Currency and it works out at around £640 (UK Pounds) which seems quite expensive for a start up package

I'm not sure if they (Your local dealer) were just trying to sell you expensive top of the range turntables, or just trying to off load some "slow sellers" onto you, or maybe D.J equipment is just expensive in New Zealand, we have other forum members on here from NZ, so i'm sure that they will be able to offer better (local) advice than me

If you were in the UK then you could probably set up a fairy good direct drive package for around £320, which would work out at around 1000 NZ$ which would be a little more realistic. Again, I can't comment on whether your dealer is being over enthusiastic, or if this is just the market price in your locality. Maybe it would pay to shop around, or at least see if there are any online internet dealers, either in NZ or in Australia, even with the shipping charge you'll possibly save $$$'s, sometimes buying locally isn't the cheapest option .

We have an Equipment Manufacturer called Gemini on this forum. They offer some very competitively priced turntables, and I believe that they have distributors all over the world. Maybe you could post a request for Rob (Gemini Uk) to supply you with the contact details of either a NZ or Australian Distributor?. I am sure that he would be happy to assist you with this, and it may be your most cost effective way of getting started.

You can find the "Gemini" support area of the forum, under "Congleton Sound & Lighting" section towards the bottom of the main index. Feel free to post up a request!.

Hi Pulsations, welcome to the forum. Have a quick glance at the rules and enjoy...

Firstly thanks for mentioning what sort of music you're into.eg: House/Trance. Neither of these genres of music feature "scratching" in them to any significant degree ... so I'm going to suggest something that may be a little contraversial...that is, I'm 80% tempted to suggest to you that whilst Direct Drive Decks are best, you may not need them for what you're planning on playing. The "doubting" 20% is that for House/Trance, you DO need a pair of decks that will stay in sync with each other when you are performing a long running mix eg: Both records stay audible together for say 2 minutes. Belt drives will stay in sync but will need more manual corrections than Direct drives.

If belt drives didnt have ANY use in the DJ market, then no-one would even manufacture them any more. Even in the next few years, where I (In my opinion) see the number of vinyl turntables on the market, reducing...I still think that there will be some reasonable quality belt-drives offered, right up until the end.

On that thought, do you already have a large collection of music which you listen to already? If so, and if its on CD, you might want to look at whether "your" music is available easily (and quickly/up front enough) on CD. You could be saving yourself some money in the long run, by looking at CD decks instead. This would also mean that your existing collection at home, instantly gives you a DJ library of tunes to "start you off"... Have you got any vinyl of your own already? Most non-DJ's havent nowadays. Also, your running costs are reduced considerably as you dont have to buy carts every year and styli every few months...that can save you quite a bit each year.

As for a mixer, again, the type of music you play tends to help narrow down the types of mixer features that you'll be after.

As you're not scratching, then user-replacable (cross)faders feature much lower of the list of priority features for example. Scratchers/turntablists sometimes complain that they've broken their crossfaders in a matter of days if practising heavily.

Kill switches or even better "Rotary kills" which are normally incorporated into the Equalisation controls (Bass, middle, Treble) of each channel of the mixer are much more suited to House/Trance music, as is an Effects Unit, or at least an Effects Send & Return loop, which allows you to add a seperate effects unit (any make/model) later on, if you wish.

Also, for mixing, you may find that Split Cue is a good feature to have. This allows you to hear what the audience would hear - through one side of your headphones, whilst in the other ear, you hear the record that you're "bringing in" to the mix.

welcome pulsations

Hey Guys,

Thanks for all your input so far. Since my last post I've got more info on this short DJ course where I'd get a hands on feel with turntables and learn more about them. The setup I was looking at getting was the Numark Battlepack

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
[

Numark Battle Pak 2003 Versiom
Everything you need to be a DJ in one box!
2 x TT1625 direct drive turntables with cartridges
1 x DM 950 Mixer
1 Pair HF 125 headphones
All cables included
1 pair slipmats

DMC Special $1,799.00 (NZ$)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

It is kinda pricey and a bit of a large step. I'm not loaded with money and this purchase would just about use up all my savings. So that's why I'm thinking about doing this DJ course before I make any large purchases.

Another thing was CD/vinal ... I currently have a computer with a cd-writer so getting music is cheap. But just downloading tracks onto cd... is that what most cd DJ's do? I'd want to stick with vinyl just to be original and also it takes more skill.... less automated.

Any more tips/advice would be appreciated

QUOTE

I currently have a computer with a cd-writer so getting music is cheap. But just downloading tracks onto cd... is that what most cd DJ's do?

Not really a good idea

QUOTE

It is kinda pricey and a bit of a large step. I'm not loaded with money and this purchase would just about use up all my savings. So that's why I'm thinking about doing this DJ course before I make any large purchases.

Good idea, going to a course will help you make your mind up. because you dont want to be buying all this expensive equipment, then selling it 6 month's down the line, when you've lost interest.

Well done for choosing Direct's

QUOTE (Dj SBD @ Jul 28 2003, 09:46 PM)

Good idea, going to a course will help you make your mind up. because you dont want to be buying all this expensive equipment, then selling it 6 month's down the line, when you've lost interest. Well done for choosing Direct's  :Thumbup:

Hello and welcome!

I do find this quote a bit controversial!

QUOTE

I'd want to stick with vinyl just to be original and also it takes more skill.... less automated.

I can understand as you are new to djing is the reason that you get this impression but it just is not true i currently own and use record decks and cd players and i would say it takes the same amount of skill to use either it is true some cd players atempt to mix and do stuff for you but as yet all fail! you still need to find the correct speed and realease the song at the correct time and of course 1 thing that a cd player or record deck will never do 4 you but is the most important thing to remember while dj'ing is play good songs!!!!

Good luck!!!

welcome to the forum! Please spare a little time to read the rules - have fun!

QUOTE

Please spare a little time to read the rules

That totally sounds like Chris put you up to that.



Welllllll...... hello to you pulsations. No matter what medium you choose, just practice, and you'll get the hang of it real fast.

GOOD LUCK!!

Hello, good eveining and welcome. Please ask any questions you wish and we will try and answer them for you.

QUOTE (Dj_Kray @ Jul 28 2003, 10:04 PM)

and of course 1 thing that a cd player or record deck will never do 4 you but is the most important thing to remember while dj'ing is play good songs!!!!

So far from what I've read I think a good DJ doesn't play 'good' songs , but they play what they enjoy and get the crowd to enjoy what they enjoy

When starting out of course you need a few well known tracks to pull out when the club isn't going off and you really want to pump them you put on a hit song

BUT one thing that I found a bit was how there are different periods in the evening. So when DJ'ing you shouldn't exhaust the crowd but allow them to party for the whole night.... be considerate and just keep it steady most the time. Any comments on this ??

QUOTE (pulsations @ Jul 31 2003, 06:42 AM)

So far from what I've read I think a good DJ doesn't play 'good' songs , but they play what they enjoy and get the crowd to enjoy what they enjoy. BUT one thing that I found a bit was how there are different periods in the evening. So when DJ'ing you shouldn't exhaust the crowd but allow them to party for the whole night.... be considerate and just keep it steady most the time. Any comments on this ??

I know that you had smilies on the bit about "DJ's play what they enjoy", so I hope that this was typed with a certain amount of tongue in cheek.

Yes, a DJ needs to be "in" to the music that they play, especially genre-specialist DJ's, where their music tends to be so up-front (or down-back) that nobody will know anything to request anyway... The same "DJs play what they enjoy" philosophy works fine in the non-paying bedroom situations too.

However for mobile work, you've got to play what you beleive (and what you've been requested) that the audience will want to hear. It might "grate" on your ears, but its commercial sense - oh and try to look happy when you play it - some of the audience really will notice.

I went to a party (as a guest) at a local sports club that had been privately rented out for a 21st birthday. It was mainly a family do - the type where the youngest members of the audience arrived in a range of pushchairs that would have impressed Mothercare, and the various grandparents arrived pre-loaded in coffins (just in case... )

Of course, the DJ (newbie - 3 mini-moon flowers, and "Flange" effect left switched on for almost every CD played) got requested to play some 60's, 70's and 80's. Which he played to a jumping floor - then killed it dead - to literally an empty floor (and sour looks) by slapping on one of his own Eminem tracks with the comment of "and after all that , back to some REAL music".

Yes, playing the right tunes for each nights "particular" audience is definately what its all about - as is using your own judgement to decide what new (or unheard of tunes) will fit the audiences expectations.

It is the old saying, what a newbie DJ really wants that older ones have is experiience.

I have played many tunes that I have hated, (like most of today's music ) but I am getting paid to play what the people want to hear, not what I want to play, otherwise people wouldn't dance, and I wouldn't get anymore gigs. They certainly would dance to most of my private collection especially to the MD I have in the van at the moment, Frank Sinatra.

....oh I dunno Ads, some of my guests would!!

Did a gig a couple of weeks ago, requested lots of Frank,and they danced to it too, apart from the obvious two (New York and My Way) try something like Bad Bad LeRoy Brown or Mack the Knife, and people will get up to it.

QUOTE (pulsations @ Jul 31 2003, 06:42 AM)

So far from what I've read I think a good DJ doesn't play 'good' songs , but they play what they enjoy and get the crowd to enjoy what they enjoy

I really hope you are joking about this comment as you will really struggle to entertain public crowds and all you will really do is get your mates to think your cool. There is prob only a handful of djs who can truelly play what they want and that is because they are so famous people know what they are going to play before they go to see them but these djs are the elite and i promise you they all went through years of playing what the crowd want, yes they all picked what genre they wanted to play.

I went to gods kitchens global gathering last saturday its prob the biggiest dance music festival in the world all the worlds best dance music djs played there and i was in in 1 tent with roger sanchez and he dropped billiy jean and the crowd went mad he kept dropping the the music in the courus so the crowd could sing and everybody did the way he got the crowd going was amazing he could of play all his new tunes, that no one had ever heard before, tunes that he knows 1 day will be big but he did not he played a perfect mix of music.

lots of other famous djs played all there new tunes and none of them got the crowd going like roger shanzhez!!

Play to the crowd! Not yourself!

hey there, another fellow kiwi!!!

yes dj gear is really expensive in nz, but if u think the sound equipment is exspensive checkout the diferance in price for lights!!!! its rediculous.

when it comes to djing in nz u have 3 routes,
(the guys at dmc or at the dj course wont tell u this bit!)

1) Mobile Dj, plays requests all night, mainly older/commercial music (average charge around $500 for five hours with 1000 watt pa and lights.
Normaly play on your own or hired equipment, mostly Cds.

2) Resident Dj, and im not talking about at "super clubs" either, at place like fat ladys arms, and other pubs/clubs that play that pop, pop- dance remix, a little bit of house/trance/hardhouse some r&b some classics etc. etc. Average pay for these gigs is around $18 - $30 an hour (less secondary tax if u have a day job!)
The bars provide the complete set up normally with cd players and a lot of the time a basic cd collection with a certain amount of play listing from the bar management.

3)A hobby dj. practise in ur bedroom, hate the music that u hear in bars, ocasionaly get a gig opening for bevan keys or sample gee. maybe if your lucky they might shout you a beer (but dont count on it) once u start getting a name you might get a set at once in a while in a small bar or at some ovf the big dance festivals like destinations again the pay wouldnt normally cover those 12"you bought the day of the gig from beatmerchants that u just had to have. give it five years and maybee you might get to the level of dj philipa, greg churchill and get paidf some money for a mix cd to go on the cover of remix.
i know this last point is cynical but bear in mind that there are only around 15 dj's in new zealand who earn enough to do it full time.

if you are after some turntables and mixers check out trademe.co.nz there are normally some bargains to be had there, and a musicworks store can normally do sharper deals on numark products than dmc.

i hope i havent put u off djing forever!!!!

I was in NZ earlier this year. I went to a club/bar (I can't remember the name of the place) in Queenstown where they were playing Soulful House. The DJ's were changing every 20 minutes! It was ridiculous, I saw at least 5 DJ's spinning in under 2 hours; which of course led to repitition of tunes. They all mixed superbly but none of the DJ's really looked at the dancefloor at all. They seemed like bedroom DJ's to me, who had managed to get a night at a club.
BTW. Those in the UK who read the above posting and are thinking that they get paid well in NZ; £1 = NZ$3 roughly.

Hi fellow kiwi

Well thanks for your insight. It did have a bit of a reality slap to it

But I'm still going ahead with the DJ course. It's going to be a hobbie. If I do get into DJ'ing I may play the odd gig but if that doesn't work out I could try producing some stuff

I know about trademe.co.nz , I'll be sure to keep an eye out.

As for what the rest of you said about playing what you like vs playing for the crowd. You made your point. I guess I could force myself to look happy when playing those 60/70/80's tunes lol, but yer I'll have to see. I'll update here when I start this DJ course... tell you how my beat matching and all the rest of it is going lol

Are you a DJ Niki at the moment? or a has been?

~

QUOTE (pulsations @ Aug 10 2003, 02:47 AM)

I guess I could force myself to look happy when playing those 60/70/80's tunes lol, but yer I'll have to see. I'll update here when I start this DJ course... tell you how my beat matching and all the rest of it is going lol

Good luck with the djing! I was not only talking about 60s 70s and 80s even with other genres such as dance and hip hop you will still need to play to the crowd even within what ever you end up playing. but again i hope it all works out

im not doinga resindency anymore just the mobile stuff, its all good though. more money in mobile work

I just have to recommend this song:

Pasilda - Knee Deep Club Mix

That's the kind of stuff I want to mix as well with trance

QUOTE (Dj_Kray @ Jul 31 2003, 12:33 PM)

QUOTE (pulsations @ Jul 31 2003, 06:42 AM) So far from what I've read I think a good DJ doesn't play 'good' songs , but they play what they enjoy and get the crowd to enjoy what they enjoy  :dj:  :dj:  :dj:   I really hope you are joking about this comment as you will really struggle to entertain public crowds and all you will really do is get your mates to think your cool. There is prob only a handful of djs who can truelly play what they want and that is because they are so famous people know what they are going to play before they go to see them but these djs are the elite and i promise you they all went through years of playing what the crowd want, yes they all picked what genre they wanted to play. I went to gods kitchens global gathering last saturday its prob the biggiest dance music festival in the world all the worlds best dance music djs played there and i was in in 1 tent with roger sanchez and he dropped billiy jean and the crowd went mad he kept dropping the the music in the courus so the crowd could sing and everybody did the way he got the crowd going was amazing he could of play all his new tunes, that no one had ever heard before, tunes that he knows 1 day will be big but he did not he played a perfect mix of music. lots of other famous djs played all there new tunes and none of them got the crowd going like roger shanzhez!! Play to the crowd! Not yourself!

QUOTE

There is prob only a handful of djs who can truelly play what they want and that is because they are so famous people know what they are going to play before they go to see them but these djs are the elite and i promise you they all went through years of playing what the crowd want

Personally, I dont think this is true. If you have good taste in music then you shouldnt have a problem. I am speaking from experience at a couple of places I used to play. The first was someone's birthday party at a club. We started playing our sort of stuff (house & trance which was requested by the birthday girl), and after about an hour the manager of the club walked over and said 'why arnt you playing chart music? You dont know the stuff that people like!' I told him that we were hired by the birthday girl and not by him so off. He then proceeded to open the club even tho it was hired for a private party, and people started piling in off the street (which I thought was damn rude, but birthday girl didnt mind). Anyway, long story short, by the end of the night there was not one person sat down, 300 people bouncing up and down on the dance floor . I found out the following day that the manager told the birthday girl that he has never had the place so full, which made me laugh.

The second was a residency at a pub in town that I had for a few months. The manager of the place did not like the music we played and was constantly telling us to play something a bit more well known. Me, being in need of an attitude transplant when it comes to being told what to do, carried on playing what we wanted with the rare chart hit thrown in just to keep him off my back. The first couple of weeks were a bit slow, but after that we had people dancing on tables cuz there wasnt enuff room anywhere else.

I use the rule of 'If it would make me dance it can make anyone dance' but its all down to personal taste at the end of the day. You've either got it, or you havn't.

BTW. I suggest you do what the manager wants if your new at this, because I did get fired from the pub after a few months, but what a laugh

please excuse the size of that quote and how many quotes, it wasnt supposed to say all that. Someone will have to teach me how to use the quote thingy

QUOTE (Euphonics @ Aug 18 2003, 05:28 PM)

BTW. I suggest you do what the manager wants if your new at this, because I did get fired from the pub after a few months, but what a laugh

BTW i was giving advice to a new dj that why i said what i did. Well done for the nights that went well what ever works for you and life is just a matter of opinions.

im still trying to perfect engaging my brain before i type, bear with me.

no offence meant

Well well well

I've had 2 lessons. In the first lesson we got aquainted with all the equipment and how to set it up properly. We also learnt how to do a simple cut. In the 2nd lesson we learnt how to do other cuts involving scratching. Next lesson we'll do more scratching and maybe start on the beat matching.

I feel I've learnt more about the general scene now. I'm still debating with myself whether I should get some turntables or not. I really would like some to practice on I know the scene isn't big in New Zealand.... but you gotta believe in yourself right

Another thing. About scratching, some DJ's say that house/trance/dance DJ's don't have as much skill as hip-hop DJ's because they just know how to beatmatch. While this may be true technically (since hip-hop DJ's arguably are better at scratching because it's used more in hip-hop) at the end of the day, a DJ is providing a service and DJ's should be judged on the crowds they pull and not by another DJ commenting on their skill level superiority. It also has to do with playing what the crowd wants to hear and getting those tracks that not many other DJ's have

I was thinking of going for top of the line gear...
eg. 2x technics 1200's and a Numark 3 channel mixer. But then again I should start with something fairly standard.. arh so confusing

QUOTE

I feel I've learnt more about the general scene now. I'm still debating with myself whether I should get some turntables or not. I really would like some to practice on  I know the scene isn't big in New Zealand.... but you gotta believe in yourself right

It sounds like you want us to convince you
I reckon you should go for it. You wouldn't be on here and speaking to so many people about it, and being so pro-active if you weren't really sure.
Don't worry about the scene not being big in NZ. Where ever there's people they need DJ's
Chris Shepherd (DJCS59) lives in a small town of 50,000 people, yet it's able to support quite a few DJ's and has given Chris a full time income for the last century or so

QUOTE

at the end of the day, a DJ is providing a service and DJ's should be judged on the crowds they pull and not by another DJ commenting on their skill level superiority.

Never worry about what other DJ's say, especially if they're being negative. The DJ's that criticise the most are often the one's who have little experience and are basically just wannabies.
Any good DJ, with experience, is more often than not likely to give you constructive criticism.

QUOTE

It also has to do with playing what the crowd wants to hear and getting those tracks that not many other DJ's have

It is most definitely all to do with playing what the crowd wants to hear, there's no point otherwise. Regarding getting tracks that other DJ's don't have; this is only important when you are doing specialist gigs, such as a certain style of music, i.e. a gig where everyone's into Trance for example but is not important for the mobile disco scene.
Good luck.

I underline and support all of the above.Good advice from the Esk

Hey Guys

Well I finished my 4 week DJ course. So I know my way around a turntable and the basics of a mixer. I've got some technics 1200's lined up which I'll get 2nd hand. But they aren't going to be sold with headshells/cartridges.

I'm thinking I would like to experiment with scratching as most new DJ's would I'd think. So I'm looking at Stanton 520's. As for the mixer I'm looking at the Behringer VMX 200. Any suggestions/comments/questions would be appreciated.

I've been purchasing vinyl from the local record shops...been spending a few hours at times in them just going through 2nd hand and new records trying to find my niche.

- John

Good luck mate! You've done the course, now walk the walk! You know you're gonna enjoy it!

Spin

THANK YOU all so much for all your input so far , I really do appreciate it!

Well guys, to update:

I completed the DJ course (4 week course) a wee while ago now. I've bought a 2nd hand DJM 300 mixer in fairly good nick. I'm still saving for decks... looking at getting some technics 1200's 2nd hand. I've been going into the local record stores at least once a week and sometimes spending hours just going through record after record.

At the moment I'm putting most my effort into house. But I don't like cheesy house with all those vocals... I prefer something unique/sophisticated/upbeat. I've got about 10 records now I'm still unsure of what genre I really want to play... I do like trance but I'm not sure if I'd like to play it out... the beat gets to me after a while. I think house is more versatile in that regards anyway.

So for now a few questions:

1) When hearing a record for the first time how do you sample it?

2) On a record how do you tell is side A or B? I mean some have labels but is there any common rule?

3) How are some records harder to mix than others? (I hear about DJ's avoiding hard to mix tracks but I have no idea what they mean)

4) When you sample (listen) to a record what do you take note of? For me I may glance at the label/artist/title of song/mix, but in general I don't pay that much attention unless I like the song.

5) What music production software would you recommend to play around with and how to go about it? (I currently have fruity loops 3.0 I think)

once again thanks for all your input

Good to here that you are going for it,shaun is the man to help you on your questions,so be patient,help is at hand

Any news on your first gig yet ?

Its good that you're not sure what genre you want to play. I wouldnt recommend sticking, or specialising in one genre at all. A single genre can go out of fashion and leave you high and dry with a large record collection.

Also, dont underestimate the popularity of lyrics. True, lyrics in a tune make it harder to mix, especially with regards to timing of mixes to avoid vocal to vocal "clashes", but songs with lyrics stick in peoples minds a lot more. eg: No-ones gonna ask you to play that one that goes "thud, thud, thudddaddy, thuda". This goes to answer your question number 3 (hard to mix tracks) ...I've heard DJ's in the local record shop turning down good songs, simply due to them not being able to mix songs featuring words. Later on in their skill sets, those same DJ's will be looking for accappella (voice, no music) tracks to drop in on top of instrumental/dub tunes.

As for the mixer...The VMX-300 (the slightly bigger, 3 channel brother to the VMX200) is reviewed here on DJU. The VMX range are nice mixers, however, if scratching, you WILL get through mixer faders/crossfaders at a surprising rate, and those faders on the VMX's are not user-replacable.